# The business case for grief support and closing advice

- **Episode:** [151](https://agents.truthliesandwork.com/episodes/151.md) (2024-12-05)
- **Type:** interview
- **Tags:** business-case, grief-support, advice
- **Time:** 46:45–58:16 (start 2805s)
- **Listen:** [https://truthliesandwork.com/151?t=2805](https://truthliesandwork.com/151?t=2805)

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[46:45] Leanne Elliott: Of course, we've, we've focused on this very much, you know, for the individual. What are the consequences, or, you know, that positive to an organization who manages this well?
[46:54] Maria Georgiou: I think you'll, you'll have— and I think I've mentioned it before— increased productivity. So everyone around you will be able to work in a way that doesn't actually disrupt What's going on? Your day-to-day work. There shouldn't really be a huge disruption. Okay, maybe someone's going to be in a bit later, but as long as everyone is involved, then actually there's that understanding there that means that work can just carry on without it feeling disrupted or without people feeling aggrieved that they might be doing more, perhaps a little bit more initially. So it's your employees are going to be happier. Happy employees lead to happier outcomes, better outcomes. So we know, we know that it will mean that actually the person who's returning to work probably won't need to take sick time, sick days off. I've spoken to so many people again in this situation who have ended up feeling that they need time out, they need time off, and they end up going off sick because they don't know how they can, how they can get that time off, or they haven't got enough time left, enough annual leave to take. So instead, they just resort to getting to going off sick. And that, that just leads to bigger problems for, for an organization. So you're going to have less sick, sick time. And I think if you approach this, and actually any, any issue that involves a person's well-being, So, you know, someone who's maybe returning to work after a mental health problem or who's going through any kind of emotional turmoil in their personal life. If it's dealt with in a way that actually feels really supportive, you're actually going to have people who aren't going to be afraid to speak up. So they're going to feel comfortable enough to be able to say, I'm not feeling well. So great, I need a little bit of time. You're just going to be in an environment that actually works better for everyone. If others who aren't obviously going through the same thing can see that that person is being supported, they're going to feel more comfortable about working where they are and about speaking up about problems that perhaps they're encountering. And that's not to say that suddenly everyone's having this kind of group of, oh, I'm going through this, I'm going through that. It's just showing that there's mechanisms in place that are there to support someone who's going through whatever it is. We spend so much time at work; the majority of our time is spent at work. So we need to be able to feel supported, feel happy. So important feeling happy. It sounds so simple. If you're not happy with what you're doing, it's going to affect your physical health. Your mental health, and it's going to affect others around you. So being able to feel that sense of happiness at work is absolutely vital. And that can only happen if the right things are in place to help those employees, to help those employees who are going through stuff at that time. If you're showing a nurturing, supportive environment, then it's going to actually— it's going to impact everyone and the way they feel. Yeah
[50:11] Al Elliott: I think that business owners and leaders often fly by the seat of their pants in this kind of situation, so these tips are perfect if you want to create a guide to follow. Obviously, Maria has had 2 very traumatic losses in the last few years, so Leanne asked her for some closing advice on helping people who have dealt with loss, especially when it comes to the obviously very difficult time of Christmas. We're also going to hear about the kind of work Maria does with organisations and also how to get in touch with her if you want to work with her
[50:36] Leanne Elliott: If there is anybody listening who perhaps is going into their first Christmas having lost a loved one, is there any message you'd have for them?
[50:43] Maria Georgiou: Give yourself time. I think allow yourself to feel what you're feeling. It's perfectly natural to feel unsettled at this time of year. It's a time of year where everyone is— everything's about family, everything's about being together, and I think having a person missing is, is really difficult. And I think it's just being— just allowing yourself to do what you want to do. So if you don't want to do a big Christmas dinner, don't do a big Christmas dinner. Do what works for you. And I think that's, that's the main thing. Don't allow pressure from others to tell you, oh, you're being miserable, it's going to make you feel worse if you don't come to a 50-person Christmas dinner at, you know, Aunt Hilda's place. It doesn't matter. So the main thing is doing what's right for you and just communicating it in a simple way. I'm not up to this right now. I'm going to do this. So it's just sticking to your— what's going to work for you. And if you're feeling really awful, if it's really hard, talk to someone. Find someone you trust and talk. Tell them how you're feeling. And that actually could— that can take the whole weight off your shoulders
[51:54] Leanne Elliott: Tell us, Maria, more about the work you're doing today. to support individuals and organizations with bereavement?
[51:59] Maria Georgiou: Lots around listening training. That's been a really important thing. And having people that— employees, not just employees, actually, we're doing this in the community as well— but having people who are trained to listen. And that literally, it's a hard thing to do. People want to listen and give advice and tell people what to do. But actually, quite often, you just need to listen. to someone and it makes them feel better. So a lot around listening, listening training, and having people who are trained listeners in place that someone can go to if they just, they just want to talk. So we're doing that training around understanding bereavement and grief. So that's really, really important. And men's mental health, which is a big one. So again, it's around training, thinking about how to how to reduce stress and how to get men talking. So there's a lot of talking and listening involved. Getting men talking about their mental health is a really difficult one. Men also behave— tend to behave differently around bereavement. So that's been really interesting. A lot of the groups that I've attended or spoken at, men don't come, or a man will come and it'll be really unusual. And their experiences do tend to be quite different. So work around getting men talking and feeling it's okay for them to talk about, about these issues. And then probably the biggest— the big thing, final thing, looking at overall well-being and happiness in the workplace and in, in kind of everyday life. So looking at scientifically proven strategies that can help employees and employers have happier employees that can obviously help with productivity, loyalty, and so on in the workplace. We've got a website, so it's www.emgeag.org. So that's where all the information is
[54:05] Al Elliott: Well, there you go. There's a masterclass in how to deal with a bereavement
[54:09] Leanne Elliott: If you have been affected by any of the themes in this episode, support is available. If you are in the UK, Samaritans— samaritans.org, visit their website, or you can call for free 116 123 24/7. Mind also has some excellent resources, mind.org.uk. And Cruise Bereavement Support, you can call 0808 808 1677 or visit cruise.org.uk. I will leave all that in the show notes along with other resources for our listeners in the US, including the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline And Grief Share, and also some global resources so you can access help wherever you're listening
[54:47] Al Elliott: Join us again next Thursday where we are bringing you a social media superstar, the incredible Cody Green, who's a TikTok sensation and a mental health advocate with almost 2 million followers. He's genuinely the talk of the town with both the USA Today and even Saturday Night Live referencing his amazing dog Luna, and he's had more than 50 million views so far in this candid episode. Cody shares his experience of living with schizophrenia and how, with the right support, people with this diagnosis can thrive in the workplace
[55:14] Leanne Elliott: If you can't wait a week, then don't worry, you can join us next Tuesday for your weekly fix of workplace news, those spicy hot takes from our expert panelists, and of course our famous workplace surgery, our weekly workplace surgery where Al puts your tough questions to me. Until then, make sure you have subscribed to the show on whatever platform you get your podcast, and if you really want supporters, consider posting on LinkedIn about how much you learned from this episode. Be sure to tag Maria. Oh, and check the show notes as well for my email address, all the contact details if you want to get into the show, and as I've mentioned, all the resources you need if you are looking for some extra support this time of year
[55:52] Al Elliott: Definitely a week to check out the show notes
[55:55] Leanne Elliott: So thank you for listening, um, and maybe just keep listening on this one. We've got a little something for See you after the music
[56:02] Al Elliott: See you in a second
[56:03] Leanne Elliott: So normally at this point, we'd put some little bloopers in here for you. If you've not listened before, you've got some catching up to do. They're usually quite funny and very, very silly. What I thought I'd do this week, because bloopers didn't seem quite right with the vibe of the episode, and we didn't actually have many this week, is just to kind of mention that one of the things that some people who are grieving feel is guilty when they do find themselves, enjoying themselves, having fun, having a nice time. And moments like that may well occur over the holidays, and that's okay. You can indulge in those moments. So if you have been reflecting on, on that episode and need maybe a little bit of something lighter, um, to shift that mood— and it's okay to shift that mood— then, then I've got a little something for you. Listeners will know, regular listeners will know that a few months ago we interviewed, um, Ed Williams, who's the CEO and founder of Candy Kittens, said Candy Kittens. I asked him what the best sweet in the world was, and he said it was his Candy Kittens sour watermelon. The team were very kind enough to send us a few samples of the sweets, but because we have been traveling, we've not been able to get our hands on them yet. But whilst on said travels, we did come across a packet in, I think it was like a, was it a card shop?
[57:24] Al Elliott: Yeah, I think it was, yeah, yeah
[57:26] Leanne Elliott: So anyway, so we thought we'd try them. We'll see if this is your favorite sweet. We'll be the judge of that, Ed. Now I should say that these are a bit of promo for Candy Kittens. These are all vegan, um, all plant-based
[57:36] Al Elliott: Thank you very much
[57:38] Leanne Elliott: See what they look like. They're quite cute, aren't they?
[57:41] Al Elliott: Oh, they're not as sour as I thought
[57:45] Leanne Elliott: I'm not mad about that
[57:47] Al Elliott: Mm-hmm. This makes good telly, isn't it? Watching people watching us eat
[57:52] Leanne Elliott: Tasty. Oh, they're getting more sour now
[57:58] Al Elliott: There you go. That's what you want. Look out for those. Approved. This message is approved by Leanne
[58:07] Leanne Elliott: Candy kittens are approved by Truth, Lies and Work podcast. Delicious. Thank you again for listening, and we will see you next week
[58:15] Al Elliott: Thank you, Ed, for the sweets. Bye-bye