# The intruder paradox: reframing imposter syndrome as a workplace problem

- **Episode:** [216](https://agents.truthliesandwork.com/episodes/216.md) (2025-07-22)
- **Type:** news-roundup
- **Tags:** imposter-syndrome, workplace-culture, mental-health
- **Time:** 0:02–10:47 (start 2s)
- **Listen:** [https://truthliesandwork.com/216?t=2](https://truthliesandwork.com/216?t=2)

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[0:02] Al Elliott: Coming up this week in work
[0:04] Leanne Elliott: Is imposter syndrome really a confidence problem or a workplace one? New research suggests it's inclusion, not insecurity, that's holding people back
[0:14] Al Elliott: And the 6 strategies you need to implement to find great people. So is this smart hiring or just old-school thinking?
[0:22] Leanne Elliott: And in the Workplace Surgery, are job boards the only way to find great talent? We are joined by recruitment experts, The Curve Group, to help one listener cut through the noise and find great people
[0:35] Al Elliott: This is Truth, Lies and Work
[0:37] Leanne Elliott: The award-winning podcast where behavioural science meets workplace culture, brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. My name is Leanne. I'm a Chartered Occupational Psychologist
[0:48] Al Elliott: My name is Al. I'm a business owner
[0:50] Leanne Elliott: And together we help organisations build amazing workplace cultures
[0:53] Al Elliott: We're going to get into all of that right after this very quick word from our sponsors
[1:30] Al Elliott: Nice. Check out hopspot.com, the agentic customer platform for growing businesses. Welcome back. This might be the last of the formal This Week in Work. Not ever, but just for July, because in August we're doing something a little— well, we're trying something a bit different, aren't we, love?
[1:49] Leanne Elliott: Yeah, well, we figured you guys are all on holiday, so we might want to have a little holiday too. Or at least do create content that feels a bit more holiday vibe. Um, and let's be honest, you're not going to want to listen to a work podcast when you're sat on the beach, nor would we encourage you to. So instead, we're going to bring you some bit lighter content that, that you'll hopefully still enjoy when you're dipping your toes in the Mediterranean
[2:12] Al Elliott: Absolutely. Or whichever sea is your preference. We don't know
[2:14] Leanne Elliott: Indeed, most seas are available
[2:16] Al Elliott: They are. So, we've got interviews with people about making work fun. On Tuesdays, it's probably gonna be me and Leanne in the garden with little lapel mics. Not gonna lie, probably a glass of wine
[2:27] Leanne Elliott: Possibly
[2:28] Al Elliott: If there's— but you'll find out if there's like more than one glass of wine because it could be even worse than it normally is. Anyway, right now is Tuesday. Right now it is July, and right now it is Leanne's favourite time of the week, I think. Did I say your name wrong, Leanne? Leanne. Leanne's favourite time. That's my name. Okay, my love, what have you seen this week?
[2:47] Leanne Elliott: I have a new word
[2:49] Al Elliott: Do you know what? You always announce it as if it's a brand new thing. Like you've, you've never come up with a new word. Every week you have a new word. Give us your new word
[2:55] Leanne Elliott: Not every week, but I seem to have been coming across a few of them recently anyway
[2:59] Al Elliott: I like new words
[2:59] Leanne Elliott: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, some are better than others. Um, my new word, let's see what this one's like. My new word is intruder paradox
[3:07] Al Elliott: Right. So I've gotta guess, haven't I? Yeah. So intruder paradox. The paradox is something which appears to be something and it's actually Something else? Is that what a paradox is?
[3:17] Leanne Elliott: Mm-hmm
[3:18] Becky Simms: Yeah
[3:18] Al Elliott: So an intruder, so it would mean someone is intruding, but they're not really intruding. I think I might have gone down a cul-de-sac here, love. Help us out
[3:27] Leanne Elliott: It's, do you know what? I'm not surprised. It's one that I must admit, I probably read a couple of times before I kind of understood it. I should say as well, this, I came across this through Matt Smead, who was actually on the show last week
[3:39] Al Elliott: Yes, I think so
[3:40] Becky Simms: Yeah
[3:40] Leanne Elliott: Just last week. Who posted this research article on LinkedIn. I thought it was kind of cool. So basically, intruder paradox is being put forward. It's an alternative term for imposter syndrome
[3:54] Al Elliott: So it's, it's not the act of being put forward. It is, it is an alternative to imposter syndrome
[4:01] Leanne Elliott: It's being suggested. It's been tabled
[4:04] Al Elliott: Reported
[4:04] Leanne Elliott: Yes
[4:04] Al Elliott: Tabled. Oh, I like that. It's been tabled
[4:06] Leanne Elliott: Yes
[4:07] Al Elliott: I like that. God, I feel like we're real corporate
[4:10] Leanne Elliott: I know, yeah
[4:11] Al Elliott: It's been tabled. Yes, look
[4:12] Leanne Elliott: Yes, let's circle back to this definition
[4:14] Al Elliott: Such idiots
[4:17] Leanne Elliott: So imposter syndrome, basically imposter syndrome says that the self-doubt comes from within
[4:24] Al Elliott: Yep
[4:24] Leanne Elliott: The intruder paradox is arguing that actually might be your environment that's making you feel like an outsider
[4:31] Al Elliott: See, now I wouldn't go—
[4:32] Leanne Elliott: Like, it's not me, it's you
[4:34] Al Elliott: But I wouldn't go with, with that. I'd go imposter is internal. Exposter syndrome is what I'd call it. Exposter syndrome
[4:41] Leanne Elliott: Because it's external. See, now this is the difference between marketers and psychologists
[4:45] Al Elliott: Marketers make it up. Psychologists have genuine— yeah
[4:47] Leanne Elliott: But yours is more catchy. You probably remember that one
[4:50] Al Elliott: Catchy but bullshit
[4:51] Becky Simms: Yeah
[4:51] Leanne Elliott: Marketing and all that sums up marketing
[4:54] Al Elliott: I'm gonna change my, my X bio to, uh, to catchy but bullshit. There you go. Right, so you can find out more ideas on catchupwithbullshit.com
[5:04] Leanne Elliott: So yeah, anyway, intruder—
[5:06] Al Elliott: Sorry, Matt, you were talking
[5:07] Leanne Elliott: Intruder paradox. Um, so yeah, Matt Matt shared this paper and basically suggests that workplace structures, norms, behaviours, the environment that we're in, um, can often trigger feelings of being an intruder, especially in people who are perhaps from underrepresented or marginalised groups. So women, People of colour. Um, we do hear a lot about imposter syndrome, probably a bit too much. Um, psychologists, interesting enough, call it imposter phenomenon. Um, I'm not sure why it got called syndrome, because it's not a syndrome, is it?
[5:36] Al Elliott: What makes a syndrome? What's a phenomenon? What's a syndrome?
[5:38] Leanne Elliott: Well, I think a syndrome is when it suggests there's something wrong
[5:41] Al Elliott: Oh, so it's kind of like—
[5:43] Leanne Elliott: Or different, I guess
[5:45] Al Elliott: So that's something you might have contracted or been born with. Do you know what, let's take this offline. Carry on. I'm totally hijacking your bit here, right? I'm gonna shut up
[5:56] Leanne Elliott: That's what I usually do. Um, so anyway, imposter syndrome, that feeling that you're not, you're not good enough, um, it's framed as a personal issue, isn't it? Like, I'm just lacking the confidence, or I'm not able to internalise my achievement, that's on me. Um, so what these researchers were saying is, what if the real problem isn't your mindset but actually the environment around you? Um, so what they did to understand this is they sampled women, 40 women working in train— working or training in medicine in Canada. So very successful women, typically male-dominated work environments. Many of these women were also from underrepresented backgrounds, and they talked about what it's like to try and succeed in a male-dominated profession. So what they found is that some women said they did feel like imposters, but not because they lacked confidence. Instead, they've been treated as if they didn't belong. So ignored, passed over, criticised unfairly. Just a regular Monday, right, ladies? Or told they weren't right for certain roles. So one woman also said, this is a quote, it's not imposter syndrome, it's you don't want me in the field. So researchers came up with a new term, the intruder paradox, to describe this
[7:07] Al Elliott: Just so I understand the difference, it's not that they're made— that they feel like they're imposters, they're made to feel like intruders
[7:15] Leanne Elliott: Exactly, exactly. So it's what, what the researchers went on to do was describe some workplace scenarios where one might feel intruder paradox. So they said subtle things like not, not being invited to key meetings, being told to tone it down, getting less credit than others, or being discouraged from going for leadership roles. And over time, that's having the impact, chips away at confidence. So even if you believe in yourself, these kind of cues, yeah, we internalise them in a, in a way that impacts our confidence, or what psychologists call self-efficacy, the belief that we can do our jobs well. Um, so yeah, I think that's the, that's the kind of the summary of the research, that instead of blaming the individuals for feeling like imposters, perhaps we need to consider the environment and actually where certain environments are making people feel like they're intruders. So I guess, Al, is this useful? Is it a word that we don't need? Is it actually describing what these women are experiencing?
[8:15] Al Elliott: I mean, most of the words you come up with are words we don't need. And you do admit to that, that some of them are just like forest bathing and stuff, which is basically just going out and not from behind your desk. I think it would be a difficult reframe because imposter syndrome has been around, what, since the '70s? So I think it would be a difficult reframe, but I think it does more accurately show what people are going through. And also just you saying that made me go, oh, oh yeah, yeah, no, I can see it. I don't think, I don't think I've done that. Maybe I have in the past, but I can definitely see how now it's not a pro— it's not the problem of these women, it's the problem of the organization or culture. Is that—
[8:55] Leanne Elliott: Yeah, yeah. And I think that's where— and Matt was a bit conflicted on this as well in his original post, which I'll leave a link to in the show notes if you want to have a read of his take on it. He was kind of the same, like, I'm not sure if it's a new term that we need. I'm not sure if it's actually describing what it's describing. Is it actually just talking about something that's more rooted in diversity and inclusion, or rather exclusion? Is it really, yeah, imposter syndrome necessarily? Equally, there's a lot of beef around imposter phenomenon that it is primarily found in women. It is rooted in research off of the '70s where women didn't have particularly great rights in the workplace and were very publicly and unashamedly undermined in work. So there's some kind of tension around that as a term as well, and also kind of how widely it's used, and people will kind of self-diagnose as having imposter syndrome. And actually, when you look at it, the kind of the really debilitating aspect of imposter syndrome, it is much smaller in terms of percentage of the population. So I think it's a— it was problematic to begin with. I think this may be making it more complicated and potentially problematic. I think what there's absolutely no doubt about is there are behaviours and systems in our workplaces that is making women and people from marginalised backgrounds, and potentially anybody who finds himself on the wrong side of somebody more powerful, These are environments that are impacting our ability to progress, to develop our careers, to perform really well, and to feel confident about what we do. So I think it's interesting. I just don't know if it's quite— I don't know if it's the same thing, you know? I don't know. I'm not sure. I, like Matt, I have more questions from this than questions answered